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> Is The Strobostomp 2 A Buffered Pedal?
roadhog96
post Feb 5 2011, 11:26 AM
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I've read on another forum that it has the ability to be a buffer or it can have the option for total true bypass. I cannot find anything in the owners manual that says it's a buffered pedal.

Said something about using an XLR adapter to convert the unbalanced signal to a low impedance balanced
signal so that there is no tone lose over the legnth of long cable. This is supposedly what a Buffer does.

If it is, how do you get it into a buffer mode.
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John Norris
post Feb 8 2011, 03:31 PM
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HI,
Make sure that all dipswitches are down and use the XLR output.

John N.
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roadhog96
post Feb 8 2011, 09:16 PM
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QUOTE (John Norris @ Feb 8 2011, 10:31 PM) *
HI,
Make sure that all dipswitches are down and use the XLR output.

John N.


Thanks for that John. I need to know how to wire The XLR adapter to a guitar cable. The plug has 3 pins and the guitar cable has two conductors. What wire to what pins

Thanks
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roadhog96
post Feb 15 2011, 06:17 PM
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QUOTE (roadhog96 @ Feb 9 2011, 04:16 AM) *
Thanks for that John. I need to know how to wire The XLR adapter to a guitar cable. The plug has 3 pins and the guitar cable has two conductors. What wire to what pins

Thanks


Bump!
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John Norris
post Feb 16 2011, 01:18 PM
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Hi Roadhog96,

Pin 2 is hot (+signal), but a better way to do this is to use an XLR cable plugged into the Stomp and an impedance matcher at the other end of the XLR:



John N.
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roadhog96
post Feb 17 2011, 11:34 AM
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QUOTE (John Norris @ Feb 16 2011, 08:18 PM) *
Hi Roadhog96,

Pin 2 is hot (+signal), but a better way to do this is to use an XLR cable plugged into the Stomp and an impedance matcher at the other end of the XLR:



John N.


Hi John,

I have to question you about the Impedance matcher you suggested to use because; The signal going into the Strobostomp 2 is a Unbalanced High Impedance signal from the guitar. I need to use a Female XLR adapter and wire it to a guitar cable with the #2 pin to the tip of the 1/4" guitar plug and pins #1 and #3 to the ground shielding. The Strobostomp 2 Active DI is proving the Balanced Low Impedance signal at the 3 pin male XLR socket. After the XLR connection using the Female XLR adapter, it will have a totally Balanced Low Impedance signal throughout the rest of the cable to the amplifier. This is what you want to do when using multiple guitar effects pedals and/or long cable runs because of the High Capacitance these conditions create.

With the Impedance matcher adapter that you recommended to use, it is designed to take a Low Impedance signal at the XLR end of the plug and transform it into a high Impedance signal at the 1/4" plug. Isn't this a little backwards from what I'm trying to achieve here? Sounds like it would be starting out with a High Impedance signal, then converting it to a Low Impedance signal, then transforming it back to a High Impedance signal. Maybe I'm missing something and you can set me straight if you would.

It would be much easier to just buy a Buffer pedal made for guitars. They are made with 1/4" jacks so that you can just plug a cable into and get the same effect without any special wiring or adapters. I just thought it made more sense to just use the existing Active DI in the Strobostomp 2 because it's already there and not being used and should be able to provide the same results.

Is there anyway you can get in touch with some Technical engineers at Peterson, maybe they have some ideas on how to do this because this seems to be getting more confusing on how this Active DI is suppose to work. Peterson makes a good product and offers very little information in the owners manual about this unique feature. I've contacted them a few times with questions about this and never received any acknowledgement on the subject. This is why I posted this question here on this Forum. Their customer service doesn't seem to be what it should be and I'm grateful your here to offer some help.

I Wonder if an adapter like this one would do all the above mentioned if it was to be plugged directly into the Strobostomp 2 Active DI XLR socket? What do you think? http://www.computercablestore.com/9_in_Dua...e__PID7994.aspx
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John Norris
post Feb 18 2011, 01:34 PM
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Hi Roadhog 69,

QUOTE
I need to use a Female XLR adapter and wire it to a guitar cable with the #2 pin to the tip of the 1/4" guitar plug and pins #1 and #3 to the ground shielding. The Strobostomp 2 Active DI is proving the Balanced Low Impedance signal at the 3 pin male XLR socket. After the XLR connection using the Female XLR adapter, it will have a totally Balanced Low Impedance signal throughout the rest of the cable to the amplifier.


Using a simple adapter as described above would work, but the signal would no longer be balanced and the impedance might be mismatched at the amp. Can't hurt to try it out, though.

QUOTE
With the Impedance matcher adapter that you recommended to use, it is designed to take a Low Impedance signal at the XLR end of the plug and transform it into a high Impedance signal at the 1/4" plug. Isn't this a little backwards from what I'm trying to achieve here? Sounds like it would be starting out with a High Impedance signal, then converting it to a Low Impedance signal, then transforming it back to a High Impedance signal. Maybe I'm missing something and you can set me straight if you would.


What it does is to take the signal from the DI output, and match the signal to the input impedance of the amp while preserving some of the benefits of a balanced line, technically you need a balanced output plugged into a balanced input (3 conductor all the way through) to have a balanced "system", that does not exist in the electric guitar/amp world (with very few exceptions).

QUOTE
It would be much easier to just buy a Buffer pedal made for guitars. They are made with 1/4" jacks so that you can just plug a cable into and get the same effect without any special wiring or adapters. I just thought it made more sense to just use the existing Active DI in the Strobostomp 2 because it's already there and not being used and should be able to provide the same results.


You could do that, the downside would be extra space needed and cost. A DI's main role is to interface unbalanced backline instruments like keyboards, acoustic guitars and basses to the balanced world of the PA system.
What we're doing here is not the same, because the world of guitar amps is largely unbalanced with high Z inputs.
The Active DI in the StroboStomp2 gives the signal a slight boost as a side effect to its main duty mentioned above, but balanced inputs on guitar amps would be needed to have an-all balanced system.
Are you looking to compensate or boost the signal because you think your signal path is very long? What are the cable distances involved in your setup?

QUOTE
Peterson makes a good product and offers very little information in the owners manual about this unique feature. I've contacted them a few times with questions about this and never received any acknowledgement on the subject. This is why I posted this question here on this Forum. Their customer service doesn't seem to be what it should be and I'm grateful your here to offer some help.


Much of the info is right here on the forum, there's also a Help Desk, but don't forget the telephone, anyone with questions can call us,contact numbers and a full list of staff are on the Peterson Tuners website.

QUOTE
I Wonder if an adapter like this one would do all the above mentioned if it was to be plugged directly into the Strobostomp 2 Active DI XLR socket? What do you think? http://www.computercablestore.com/9_in_Dua...e__PID7994.aspx


Its essentially the same thing as the unit I mentioned in a post above, just a little less compact and costs more.

John N.
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roadhog96
post Feb 19 2011, 01:54 PM
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QUOTE (John Norris @ Feb 18 2011, 08:34 PM) *
Hi Roadhog 69,



Using a simple adapter as described above would work, but the signal would no longer be balanced and the impedance might be mismatched at the amp. Can't hurt to try it out, though.



What it does is to take the signal from the DI output, and match the signal to the input impedance of the amp while preserving some of the benefits of a balanced line, technically you need a balanced output plugged into a balanced input (3 conductor all the way through) to have a balanced "system", that does not exist in the electric guitar/amp world (with very few exceptions).



You could do that, the downside would be extra space needed and cost. A DI's main role is to interface unbalanced backline instruments like keyboards, acoustic guitars and basses to the balanced world of the PA system.
What we're doing here is not the same, because the world of guitar amps is largely unbalanced with high Z inputs.
The Active DI in the StroboStomp2 gives the signal a slight boost as a side effect to its main duty mentioned above, but balanced inputs on guitar amps would be needed to have an-all balanced system.
Are you looking to compensate or boost the signal because you think your signal path is very long? What are the cable distances involved in your setup?



Much of the info is right here on the forum, there's also a Help Desk, but don't forget the telephone, anyone with questions can call us,contact numbers and a full list of staff are on the Peterson Tuners website.



Its essentially the same thing as the unit I mentioned in a post above, just a little less compact and costs more.

John N.


Thanks so much for the detailed explanations they were a big help.

I'm using Mogami 2524 instrument cable for everything including several short patch cables for the effects. The Mogami cable has a capacitance of 39.7pF/ft. I have 25ft. from guitar to Strobostomp 2. From there it goes through several effect with very short pieces of patch cables maybe 6ft. Then from there to the amp is another 25ft . So there is over 50ft. of cable all together from guitar to amp.

If I plug the guitar directly into the amp using only one 25ft cable, I can hear a big differences in the tone. I'm losing to much highs even with good quality, long lengths of cable. I use a A/B double loop switch box to alternate between sending the signal to either channel of one amp or to a second amp with several other cables. Still there is only a little over 50ft. being used at any given time because all cables are made to 25ft. in length. I have a good amount invested into all this cable.

I have also tried using just a 10ft cable from guitar to amp and again, I can hear a slight difference between the 10ft and one 25ft. so it sounds as though I need to probably boost the signal because of the length of cable.

You said that the Impedance Matcher Transformer takes the signal from the DI output, and matches the signal to the input impedance of the amp while preserving some of the benefits of a balanced line.

The only problem I see with the one you recommend is the 1/4" male plug comes straight out the back of the Transformer. This will not line up with any other input jacks on any other pedals because they are mounted to the sides of the boxes. I need to go from this Impedance Matcher Transformer into another pedal that sits beside the Strobostomp 2. One that has a short piece of cable or one that has a Female end that I can plug a patch cable with a 1/4" Male plug directly into would be what I need. This is the only reason I posted a LINK to the one that has the cable and is switchable. I may not need the switchable feature of these adapters but they way they would plug into the rest of my setup is just as important to make this work.

This one; http://www.computercablestore.com/Dual_Imp...ch_PID7991.aspx

or this one; http://www.computercablestore.com/9_in_Dua...e__PID7994.aspx

So your confident either one would do what you suggest?

The reason for so much confusing is I asked this question on several other Forums and every reply to the question said I did not need an Impedance Matching Transformer to accomplish this, a simple XLR Female adapter to 1/4"Male would work just fine. I've also read that without the Transformer it would sound terrible. So I really don't know without hearing it.
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John Norris
post Feb 21 2011, 04:07 PM
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Hi Roadhog96,
Try it with a simple XLR to 1/4" adapter first, your ears will tell you if thats good enough.
What FX are you going through? They may be affecting your tone more than the cable.


John N.
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roadhog96
post Feb 23 2011, 11:20 AM
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QUOTE (John Norris @ Feb 21 2011, 11:07 PM) *
Hi Roadhog96,
Try it with a simple XLR to 1/4" adapter first, your ears will tell you if thats good enough.
What FX are you going through? They may be affecting your tone more than the cable.


John N.


Hi John,

Presently I only have three pedals, a Strobostomp 2, the MXR Carbon Copy Analog Delay, and a A/B 2 Loop Switch Box. All these pedals have True Total Bypass and I go into the front of the amp, I do not have any amps with built in FX loops.

I've even tried using one 25ft cable from guitar straight into the pedals and from the pedals into the amp with just a 6 inch patch cable and it's no different than using just a single 25ft cable in tone. Everything changes when I add the 2nd 25ft cable after the pedals to the amp. It's the cable length for sure I'm positive. I've tried all sorts of testing with and without the pedals to isolate the source of the problem.

I think I'll give the XLR to 1/4" adapter a try anyway. I had also discussed this with a Boutique Guitar effects pedal builder and this is what he had to say about this whole deal.

The DI in the Strobo-Stomp has an amplitude that is ½ of the input signal, which means that the unbalanced signal from an XLR to tele adapter connected to the active DI would be -12dB in relation to the input signal.

Attenuation of such magnitude would not be an attractive trait in a buffer in an application where unity gain is desired; a standalone buffer or buffered bypass pedal seems to be a better option

The input impedance of the Strobo-Stomp is stated to be 1MΩ. That is true when configured for true bypass operation, in the other modes the input impedance is ½MΩ.

Would you agree with these statements? If it's true that there would be a 12dB difference I'm probably not going to want this because I'm sure it's going to be very noticeable.
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John Norris
post Feb 24 2011, 04:45 PM
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Hi Roadhog96,
I have no data for when the DI output is used with a simple XLR to mono 1/4" cord since the signal loses its balanced status in that scenario but it would seem that it might not be the best way to go.
Try the buffer pedal, although it may change your sound a bit, or maybe try using the amp controls to make up whatever you are losiing over the cable run.

John N.
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roadhog96
post Feb 26 2011, 02:09 PM
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QUOTE (John Norris @ Feb 24 2011, 11:45 PM) *
Hi Roadhog96,
I have no data for when the DI output is used with a simple XLR to mono 1/4" cord since the signal loses its balanced status in that scenario but it would seem that it might not be the best way to go.
Try the buffer pedal, although it may change your sound a bit, or maybe try using the amp controls to make up whatever you are losiing over the cable run.

John N.


Thanks John,

Every player I've talked to that has had the same issues has solved it with a Buffer pedal. I think the Buffer will be the simplest solution to capacitance lose. Just seemed like an easy fix using the Active DI for this purpose, oh well.
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